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Becoming Whole
Relationships and sexuality are areas of life that can be beautiful or confusing, life-giving, or painful. Becoming Whole is a conversational podcast for men, women, and families seeking to draw nearer to Jesus as they navigate topics like sexual integrity, relational healing, spiritual health, and so much more.
Becoming Whole
Marriage Recovery: How Full Therapeutic Disclosure Heals Relationships
Imagine driving past a house that looks a bit off, maybe the porch is sagging, or the house seems to lean. That’s what happens when a foundation is compromised, and you know, relationships can face the same troubles, especially after betrayal. Today's podcast talks about how full therapeutic disclosure can be a game-changer for couples dealing with betrayal. It’s like laying down a solid truth foundation. It’s not just about spilling the beans; it’s about sharing everything in a safe, guided space. While the disclosing partner might feel a sigh of relief, the betrayed partner gets the information needed to begin healing. It's quite a journey, holding each other's hearts gently and stepping into healing with honesty and care. It often leads to a relationship full of renewed trust and intimacy, stronger than before. If you or someone you know is walking this path, there’s hope and help out there to rebuild that foundation.
Intimacy Pyramid from Dan Drake and Raabsmiths
- Full Therapeutic Disclosure Links
Books for couples
- Disclosing Spouse
- Betrayed Spouse (Three Volumes)
- https://disclosurehope.com/
Free Resources to help you on your journey to Becoming Whole
👉Men's Overcoming Lust & Temptation Devotional
👉Women 21-Day Prayer Journal & Devotional - (Women overcoming unwanted sexual Behavior)
👉Compass 21-Day Prayer Journal & Devotional - (Wives who are or have been impacted by partner betrayal)
Have you ever been on a drive and noticed a house where something just looked off? I mean, maybe the porch was crooked or sagging, or maybe it looked like the house was leaning even or sinking into the ground. This is probably due to a compromise in the building's foundation. To a compromise in the building's foundation, something happened that has caused that original design and function of that structure to no longer be able to stand as it was designed. And, friends, this can happen in relationships as well, especially when there is some form of betrayal. On today's podcast, we're going to discuss the full therapeutic disclosure and why it may be beneficial for couples who have experienced betrayal. Experienced betrayal. My name is Aaron Taggart and I am one of our men's spiritual coaches here at Regen, and I am joined today by my amazing colleague, anne Donahue. Anne is one of our women's spiritual coaches at Regeneration and she leads our wives groups for betrayed partners, and I've had the privilege of working alongside Anne as we walk with couples through the full therapeutic disclosure process. Anne, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:Thank you. I'm so glad that I'm here and I have really appreciated being able to work with you, aaron, on full therapeutic disclosures, and I am ready to dive in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, me too. It has been great working with you and working with couples and just seeing what God can do through a process, a hard process, Because his heart is for relationship and covenant and healing, and this process really gives couples a chance at that. And so, yeah, let's dive in a little bit to just kind of what is. I know some of our listeners might be thinking what in the world is a full therapeutic disclosure and why would a couple ever consider doing one? So let's just start there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right. Why in the world would I go through a process like this, go through a process like this? And I would say I you know from a more formal, like technical process. It's, it's the right of truth, it's it's a one space to hear a protected, to be protected and bring, bring the truth, laying the foundation of truth for a couple, but in a really safe setting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It does lay some really important groundwork for the rest of that relationship to really flourish. That foundation of truth has to be really solid.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I love the word. Don't be scared by the word therapeutic.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, full, we'll get to full. But therapeutic right Is just safe. Both husband and wife are protected and supported and guided through this truth-telling process.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's so good, anne. I think that's such a good thing really. Just to emphasize yeah, this isn't a therapist's office per se type, just like. I think when people hear therapy, they're like, oh my gosh, what am I getting into? And I think you've framed that so well, because it really is about holding both the disclosing partner and the betrayed partner through a process where they are cared for, encouraged and with people who have been trained you and I have been trained.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:And there are a lot of benefits and fruit that come from this process. But it begins really by holding this couple up and I picture kind of like Aaron and her holding up Moses so Moses can do the really hard work. And it's like you and I are kind of, and other clinicians and coaches and guides out there who do this work are really helping to hold that couple as they walk through something so delicate and hard for their relationship.
Speaker 2:I mean just that picture, aaron, of being held up, because when there's betrayal, the wife is laid flat. Right, she's discovered something on her husband's phone. Her husband disclosed something late at night. Like I have been, I've been hurting you and I've been lying so flat out two people laid flat out, and somehow the truth has to be able to be shared. And then the couple needs support to help stand up. And that's the disclosing process, right, it's typically gone very poorly, right, not anybody's fault, but just those original, those not original, but those first days, those first minutes of, you know, a deception being discovered or something being disclosed happens late at night and nobody is in the right frame of mind or space to hear the truth or give the truth. And those first go at it don't go well, and we've been couples. Stop the destruction, stop the drip disclosure and try to get support and help for couples, you know, at the worst hour of their lives at the worst hour of their lives.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, and you were mentioning kind of the trips and drabs or sort of these kind of scattered disclosures like different events or different things that are disclosed over time, instead of in this process.
Speaker 1:Everything's kind of laid out in one process and we'll get into that in a minute. But I think a real benefit of doing that way, especially for the betrayed partner, is that you know, if you imagine if this process was, you know, like there's a wound or a cut and that cut begins to heal and then something else comes out. It's like ripping that wound wide open all over again, every time, every time, every time. And it's just really hard for healing to take place when you're just constantly wounded by another thing, another thing, another thing. And so I think that's one of the benefits of being able to do the full therapeutic disclosures, because it tries to get all that information out in one sort of sitting and write a truth, instead of kind of rewounding, rewounding, rewounding. That wound might feel really big, really hard, but it will now be able to begin to heal because it's not being ripped open with new information or additional details time and time again.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Right. I feel like I've heard it also as a form of an x-ray Boy. You know, my kids have broken their wrists each a couple of times and nobody would go in, you know, and perform a surgery on a broken wrist without an x-ray right, without knowing the extent of the break. Did it need surgery? Did it need a cast? So knowing the extent of betrayal helps a spouse ground and then, like you were sharing fully heal, not just put a what are those? Bandages, gauze, yeah, gauze, or really really x-raying the problem to like? What do we need the problem to like what do we need what? And so let's you know, let's kind of dive in and try to explain this, you know, as best we can.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, because, like, if they're going to do something, some sort of procedure, they need to know what they're getting into right. The doctors need to know what they're getting into to how to help that person heal the most.
Speaker 2:And how to really help create trust, safety, vulnerability, intimacy, right With truth. Yeah, I've heard like couples really share, like it really reestablished a story of we.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Can you share a little bit more about that?
Speaker 2:Just that power in that, that story of we reestablishing the story of we Well, when a wife learns of behaviors going on outside of you know her intimate relationship, it all of a sudden we is broken and it feels safety is broken, trust is broken and all of a sudden I'm alone. Now there's no we. How can there be a we if what I assumed was our relationship was truth? What I assumed was honesty, protection, loyalty. Our sexual relationship was between the two of us, and so when there's a break in that, truth has to be re-established in order to to build safety and vulnerability and intimacy. So truth, you know, we're kind of talking about the end story here, which you know, we'll kind of do the in-betweens, but it, it reestablishes the story of we, when both people know the same truth, the same story, the same information. Yeah, and there's more. There's more I can say, but we'll, we'll kind of take our time as we go along.
Speaker 1:No, we're going to take our time as we go along. No, we're going to get into it for sure. Yeah, and I think what's really interesting about this process and this will kind of come up in a couple of these different areas too is, you know, there are two very different experiences of the same event. We're kind of talking about this disclosure process, so there's a very different experience for the one doing the disclosing, the discloser, and the experience of the betrayed partner, and we'll unpack that a little bit more. But the reality is that there has been this event, and how do we walk alongside these couples in that process? So let's go ahead and get into the first sort of part of that, which we've already kind of alluded to. It's just the importance of lay out a sort of list of different ways of acting out, including ways of deception and withholding information and the ways and lengths that that has maybe gone to, and ultimately, there's a lot of voice that the betray partner has in this process. Speak a little bit to that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thanks for bringing that up. First of all, there's workbooks, right, each spouse gets a workbook. I'm not going to hide that. These are kind of like college textbooks but they're large print so we ease into it. But you're right, the betrayed spouse has a lot of say and she gets to decide what is shared versus what is not shared and there's something called a disclosure menu that she can work through with her coach and they'll go through line by line.
Speaker 2:I want to know this. I'm not sure if I want to know that and let's talk about it. I know absolutely. I've got to be told you know X, y, z and it's they call it a menu because she can determine, take her time on how much she wants to know and how little, and that's an important process. Like, we don't have time to go in and out of that, but you can definitely reach out to Aaron and I and ask for more information about anything we talk about today. But there's so much voice that the wife gets to have, she gets to ask for the truth and how she wants the truth.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that autonomy is super important, yeah. And then the disclosing individual takes that information and works you know, in our cases, works with me to begin to kind of craft that statement, all that information, and to answer those questions, knowing that this information is actually a step in the healing process for his wife, for the betrayed individual, to begin to just get that information and for their relationship Again, that foundation of truth, that all the truth is now out. There's no more hiding, there's no more, yeah, kind of again just picturing Jesus is in the garden with Adam and Eve and they're hiding. There's no more, yeah, kind of you know, again just picturing Jesus is, you know, in the garden with Adam and Eve and they're hiding. Shame, but God knows that they're there, but it's there. You know, they were afraid. And so now there's this okay, all the information is out, I'm not in hiding anymore.
Speaker 1:And there's a lot of freedom in that for the disclosing individual. And that's kind of what I meant earlier by these two very different experiences of the same thing where he might be feeling a little like oh my gosh, I've been carrying this weight for so long and wanted to say something. I couldn't because of shame and these different things. Right, there's a sort of sigh relief for him to kind of get that information out, and that's very real, it's very freeing and that's very important stuff for his healing journey.
Speaker 1:But now, at the same token, there's a very different experience that happens at the hand of that information, and so that's just something to kind of think about and reconcile in this process. That it's not oh my gosh, I got all the information out now Everything's going to be better, it's okay. That's just something to kind of think about and reconcile in this process. That it's not oh my gosh, I got all the information out now Everything's going to be better, it's okay. Like, now you're taking steps. They're both kind of taking steps in their own journey which ultimately again, hopefully you know takes them up that pyramid to that reestablishing me or we sorry, not me we establishing we in that process and I have, you know, heard pushback about that.
Speaker 2:No way, why would you want me to tell her everything that is going to crush her, that is going to make everything worse. I'm, I'm going to worse, I'm going to. You're asking me to make it worse? Well, actually, what they have found is that knowledge for her, for the wife, is power. And I would love to say who coined this? I'm not stealing this, but most wives would say hurt me with the truth, kill me with a lie. And this is such a thoughtful process that he's working through and there are so many benefits. Yes, he may feel relief, but now she's carrying the weight of the truth. But she had to have that in order to heal. It was a right right, the right of truth. So, like we're saying, it's not an easy process. Don't? We're not taking this lightly. You know, we know this comes with pain and sorrow.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. This is really happy stuff, but just so important and all the more reason to be able to have conversations and talk about. You know where do you go, what do you do when you're facing these sort of challenges in your marriage, and maybe you know somebody that's going through something like how and you want to see them, you know, get help and different things like so, yeah, this is such a hard and beautiful process, and you know. And the other thing too is that you know I heard the host of the Pure Sex Radio podcast talk about. You know, confession changes nothing without brokenness and repentance. So there's even a posture that the disclosing individual brings to this right.
Speaker 1:It isn't about just you know, that self-seeking kind of here's all the information. I'm going to unload this and unburden myself. It really is a move towards the brokenness and repentance. Hear and see the impact of, of what all that has done to, to, in most cases, the wife and or just, you know, the betrayed, the betrayed partner and that's actually the second phase of the process is the impact letter. So let's talk a little bit about what does that look like in this process?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is. It's just what Aaron said. It's the second part. The first part is writing the disclosure and sharing reading the disclosure. Right, and I'll just back up a little.
Speaker 2:It's with all parties, right, you know, aaron and I are there and the husband and the wife are there. So it's the reading, is the first part, crafting it, writing it, reading it. Then afterwards, you know, she can ask questions. She's, you know, she's, here's the truth, ask questions. And then the couple enters the second phase, which is the grieving spouse. The betrayed spouse, has the opportunity to write an impact letter and it's over time, right, because she's absorbing now what she's learned. Possibly there are new things shared in the rite of truth, and she's grieving.
Speaker 2:The emotion is expressed in her letter, her letter, every impact it's had financially, the financial impact on her and on the family, the physical impact on her, what it was like to hear the discoveries, what her body experienced. Was it anxiety, depression, ruminating thoughts? She lost time from work. Like this is her letter of impact sexually, how she was impacted. And spiritually, did it interrupt her relationship with God? Was she not as trusting Like God? How you know, how could you have done this to me?
Speaker 2:I've been praying for our marriage, I've been working on our marriage, I have been believing you for our marriage and now, now, this is what I'm learning, now, this is where I am, and so this is a real, meaningful, difficult, painful part of the disclosure and she's allowed to take her time and look at all aspects of her life and all the aspects of the impact, of the impact, and meanwhile, right, the husband is working with a coach like Aaron and is preparing himself to receive the impact graciously, without defense and how, really establishing a safety, you know, establishing being a safe person when she shares this. Any of your thoughts, aaron, about this impact part?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, what I've seen happen over and over again for the disclosing individual is that when, when he gets to this particular part, it's very, very difficult, not that sharing the information and all the truth maybe it wasn't difficult but to now hear it and to kind of face it and to realize that what I see happen a lot is guys turning inward towards shame, and so there's a lot of work that they have to do in this sense of being able to, to be present and to be able to hear and to know that you know what the, what their partner is sharing is not out of a place of, you know, condemnation and different things. It's a. It's actually an invitation to intimacy. It's a. It's a it's a place of knowing you know how this impact and how that can actually change and transform you know the hearts, you know being able to, to be present and to show up Right. So you know, I tell guys, some of the hardest work in recovery is actually growing in empathy and learning to maybe be present in ways that you haven't been present before because of these other things were in the way. Now these things are out of the way and now we have to learn how to be present, how to show up more, how to just to extend that empathy, to allow her to express her emotions.
Speaker 1:There's three things that she needs to heal she needs to be able to express her emotions, she needs to be able to ask questions and she needs those questions answered and that every possible motive for acting out is explored, so that why did you do that? And even if the disclosing individual doesn't have the answers yet and I know that to be the case, but the posture being I don't know right now, but I'm going to work to try to figure that out I want to move in that direction. I don't have that answer for you and not just leaving it as I don't know, I don't know why. You know a lot of you know fights maybe kind of end there or there's just no way you can go forward if that's the ending, but I don't know why. But I'm going to work to find out. And there's a difference in that.
Speaker 2:There is a difference, aaron, and I really appreciate how you are giving space for that. And it's really holding your partner's heart. It's crushed, it's wounded. It's crushed, it's wounded, it's scared, it's angry, and just holding it, holding space Like we've seen it. Aaron, right, you know, we've seen it. Aaron, right, you know, we've seen it. It can be a tender place when the impact is shared and there's a silent holding.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you know I say I use this, you know, with the men that I coach and that you know the encouragement to be kind of like a container, a vase, a cup, you know whatever it might be right to be able to hold, like you know the the their spouse is pouring out, you know, can you hold, can you hold that and even having them sometimes just like, even in a session, kind of like they're holding with their hands, like a cup in their hands, just holding that space to be able to allow that, because it's very healing and it can be very hard because and I think there's a whole nother podcast, many podcasts that we could do on different elements of this and that journey for each of these individuals that might go through this process but I think you know just that, being able to hold space and growing in that because, again, this might be some really foreign territory, right.
Speaker 2:Oh, you right, it is foreign territory, right yeah. Territory right yeah, because obviously honesty hasn't, you know, been able to, wasn't given, and it was necessary for a marriage to build towards, to be building an intimacy, growing an intimacy, right. The intimacy pyramid that you know, I know we're going to get to, but that truth and honesty is that strongest base. Right of a house, right Building a family, the strongest foundation is truthfulness and honesty and that is the full therapeutic disclosure. Really it's telling the truth and then the wife sharing the enormous impact that is had on her and then the husband holding it. Do you want to share the third part, aaron?
Speaker 1:Yeah, speaking of that kind of holding it, that kind of gets into, that's not like a one and done for those. Listening you know, like you know you're, maybe you're holding this information and this heaviness and your spouse's heart in a new way, maybe for the first time, and hearing those words and the ways that the acting out has affected her, the deception has affected her, the gaslighting, the lack of accountability, all these different things that the disclosing individual then sits with that for a little bit again through coaching and through being kind of cared for, and then writes an empathy letter or empathy letter of restitution. And this is really just a reflection of the listening and responding empathetically. These are like you. You put some really good words to this. We were getting ready for this and you said that it's listening and responding empathetically to the pain the betrayed partner has endured. Yeah, and this process is really acknowledging the impact of those behaviors, how it affected the betrayed partner, the thoughts that she might have about herself, about the relationship, about, you know, do I even know my husband and wanting to move forward on a path, taking ownership of the behaviors, of the level of deception and the different, maybe, ways of deceiving and withholding that information and then that path forward. The accountability what do recovery plans look like? You know the accountability, but what are recovery plans look like ultimately, how? How is safety going to be created to help that couple essentially move up that pyramid of intimacy?
Speaker 1:And and what's so interesting is when I'm, when with these men, I find that and again I alluded to this earlier like after they share, there's this, oh gosh, like it's all out there and now they kind of want to go from. Now the truth is out, like, please, trust me. Again, I've shared all the truth. Now, trust me, can you please like, can we get back to like, can you trust me? There's nothing else? Like, please, let's you know. And all the truth, now, trust me, can you please like, can we get back to like, can you trust me, there's nothing else? Like, please, let's you know. And but there's a problem, there's not safety, and that's that second layer, right? So guys want to jump these different levels truth to trust without what's needed to provide the safety, and this is a a part of hey, this is how really I think this could be called like the safety letter, like this is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I like that.
Speaker 1:I just came to me. But this is how I want to create safety for you moving forward so that we there's that I want to get back Can we get to the place of we? So here's what I want to need to do for you moving forward so that we there's that I want to get back, can we get to the place of we? So here's what I want to need to do for you and also for me my recovery, so that we right fill in the blank, that we can experience the trust and the vulnerability and the intimacy again. And in so many ways and I know with couples that we've worked with have expressed having a better marriage than they've ever had going through the process, which seems mind blowing, like how can that be a God's restorative work in his heart? And you know anyway, you want to speak to that.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, I love the fact that it starts with cleaning out the wound, right, like you know, sticking with the process of cleaning out the wound to be able to get to the healing, get to the healing and get to the later stages. And there are couples who are walking now in healing and they're walking now in going to marriage conferences, going to deeper marriage counseling work, going to deeper marriage counseling work. They're able now to go to marriage counseling because the wound is being addressed and it's beautiful, right, it's beautiful and it's courageous and I'm proud of both the husband and the wife who are willing to go through this process. And actually it really does get to the more intimate marriage that people are actually wanted. When they said I do, but there was, oh, there was lying and deception in the way and they, they couldn't get there.
Speaker 1:It was impossible yeah, yeah, this, this really allows the fullness of what that relationship can be without you know, without any hiding, without any secrets, and you know without any hiding or without any secrets and you know, without any sort of internal tug of wars that you know often say to the men that I work with you know there's, when it comes to your relationship, there's not, there's before that really starts to heal.
Speaker 1:You've got to, you've got to heal, and she needs she's needs to heal, and then as you both heal, you're kind of bringing sort of that healing together and your relationship starts to heal. Yeah, more you heal and the more she heals, the more your relationship will heal. And it's really interesting how that really is so true, like, and I think about, as as you talk about the these different analogies with the doctors and things like there are specialists Like we go to, you know, if there's a cancer, we see an oncologist. We don't go to the foot doctor, you know, like even that's a specialty but that's you know. But there are therapists who do this, coaches who in this, because it is sort of a specialty to go through this and to know how to help a couple, and so, yeah, that just comes to mind, as you're kind of talking about the different kind of analogies of wounds and healing, that if you want to really heal a particular wound in a particular way, you may need a specialist.
Speaker 2:Right, and you know you may be. You know listening to this and you're two years in post-discovery and you haven't done this. It's not too late. It's. It's not too late to do a full therapeutic disclosure. You know so many. You know women I've coached. You know they jumped from discovery to marriage work and that they didn't have the truth and it became a communication problem. And this isn't a communication problem, it's a deception problem, right? And so, wherever you are, you can back up and reach out or, you know, go, look at these books. We're going to have it in the show notes. You know Dan Drake and Janice Caldwell. You know full therapeutic disclosures and there's workbooks. And it's never too late. You can always begin again. Right, his mercy is new every morning. Great is his faithfulness. We're here, our door is open, and we would love to be one step in the process of healing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's so good. And yeah, I think I would just add you know, I know that you know we've talked a lot about mentioning the intimacy pyramid. We'll put that in the show notes. Actually, next week's episode, listeners will get to hear a little bit more about that as our executive director, Josh, sits down with the Rav Smiths and have a conversation A little bit of their story but also on the intimacy pyramid and so more of that to come.
Speaker 2:But I would just love to close this out in a word of prayer Awesome.
Speaker 1:Thanks, aaron. Jesus, we thank you for this conversation today, lord, and we thank you that, at the very heart, lord, of the heavy and the brokenness and Lord, the things that we talked about today, lord is your heart, the things that we talked about today, lord is your heart, your heart for couples, lord, for marriage, for covenant, for healing Lord, and we just invite your healing Lord for anyone listening, lord, anyone who's been on that journey or is looking to step into that journey, lord, that you would meet them, lord, with your faithfulness and your grace, lord, that you would indeed hold them up, lord, through the process, like Aaron and her. That you would be with them every step of the way and that you would bring Lord repair to what might seem irreparable. That you are a God, lord, who can work in that way. And so we thank you, lord, for your heart and for all that you've done, lord, and all that you have yet to do and long to do. Lord, in and through Lord relationships. We ask these things in Jesus' name, amen.
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